Laura Brown and Christina O’Neal were at the top of their game. They landed dream jobs as magazine editors, with Brown working at InStyle and O’Neal at WSJ. magazine.
Then they were fired.
By the way, that’s their preferred terminology. It is not part of restructuring, downsizing, or layoffs.
“It’s a similar job, but a different day,” Brown, who was fired from Instyle in 2022 via Zoom, told CNBC Make It. “This is hitting you over the head with an anvil. And then you embarrass yourself even more (and) use weird language and build a story for yourself that’s not even true, everything (feels like) when you’re already three feet tall.”
“No matter what you call it, it’s the same feeling,” said O’Neill, who was fired from the Journal in 2023.
The two friends, who met at a Marc Jacobs fashion show in 2001 and have spent more than 20 years building their careers together, have written candidly about losing their jobs within a year of each other in their new book, All the Cool Girls Get Fired.
It’s the book they didn’t have when they were laid off, about severance pay, health insurance, and getting back on track with their careers “feeling more professional than ever,” as well as personal essays by icons like Jamie Lee Curtis and Oprah about how they got fired.
CNBC Make It spoke with Brown, who has since started her own company, LB Media, and O’Neal, who is now head of media at Sotheby’s, about everything they learned from being fired and writing this book.
Why you shouldn’t spend a lot of time alone after being fired
Laura Brown: It’s very important to rest, but don’t back down. Spending too much time alone just makes you feel worse all the time. All those bad thoughts compound. So don’t do that and listen to yourself.
Have coffee with someone. Let’s have breakfast. You don’t have to do everything in one day. Admittedly, we both started doing funny things in the stomach after we got fired. And we thought, “Oh, I guess we shouldn’t have done that.” Be coordinated enough to do odd things like answer emails, make phone calls, and use Zoom.
It’s often breaking news, but stepping out of your apartment and into the outside world makes you feel good, remembering that there’s a whole world beyond you and a dwindling bank balance. These small options will open up to you. Just choose carefully. There are no quotas to meet. Do what we call “proofing yourself”.
If you are good and work hard, people will show up.
Christina O’Neill: I call it “Scarlet F.” I think a lot of people feel like when they walk into a room, everyone turns around and stares at them and goes, “Oh, she’s here.” It’s all in your head.
Talking about it helps. It helps to call it what it is. It helps to have fired crew members.
How to approach networking: “Don’t be ashamed to ask for something.”
LB: Networking is simply getting to know people and finding opportunities. But it seems like it comes with a mercenary scenario like this: “I’m going to go to corporate parties and network, and this is my business card.” Always sounds so aggressive. I think we all network naturally throughout our careers. My husband calls it “Johnny Appleseed-ing.” Just keep throwing seeds. And when something like this happens, when you get fired or there’s a big change, there’s actually an orchard that you’ve built in your work and your relationships.
If you are good and work hard, people will show up. And the environment we’re in now has created far more empathy in the workplace and in recruitment than ever before.
Number one, don’t be ashamed to ask for things. Because everyone does, and everyone will. The second is understanding that the way you navigate yourself may be different than what you grew up with. Because there are different options, different schedules, and different ways to make money.
Look around the corner and think, “Wow, there are so many more opportunities out there that are different than the environment I grew up in,” and listen to yourself a little bit.
Ask yourself, ‘Was it my dream job, or did I not really like it?’ Did I feel like myself? Did I feel obligated? Did you feel comfortable? Sometimes you may be shocked by this reappraisal that serves you well. Financial priorities are always the number one priority. But if you have even a little bit of time, you might not think about these things when you’re doing this mechanical work.
Separate your sense of self from your work
KO: Even if you put everything you have into your career, when that job is taken away, it all falls apart. We had ourselves, each other, friends and family. Even if it’s just something you like to read or go to Pilates, it helps if it’s something very simple that makes you feel human.
Easier said than done. When you’re in a high-profile role, when you’re introduced to people, you’re like so-and-so, and then suddenly you’re not. What surprised me in our community was that many people said, “We don’t care if you don’t work there anymore.” But we still want you to come with us. ‘It gives you a lot of confidence.
be fired as a boss
LB: I got fired from my entire team over Zoom. I started this speech by talking about your worth right now. Everything you achieve is yours. It doesn’t belong to the company. They didn’t take that away from you.
I remember saying: “Don’t give them the power to think this was done to you.” Don’t add this to yourself. Take everything you have learned, all your abilities, skills, they are yours and you will be able to take them somewhere else. ”
Our hopes and dreams for this book are that you can understand the basic idea of what it means to be fired and how to get through it and come out stronger and face what comes next.
KO: I was one of those fired. I was the boss of a team of about 50 people. There was uncertainty as to who would replace me and what that would look like, and that caused a lot of anxiety for the team. As much as I wanted to hold their hands, at some point I had to watch myself.
I loved my team and we were very close-knit. We decided to have a party and it was great. There was a closing. Unfortunately, I think in many workplaces, when things happen quickly, there is no moment for everyone to come together and have a last hurray. So even if your workplace doesn’t allow you to have a party, I highly recommend it. When you quit, make sure you finish it. I think that will allow me to move on.
How to deal with someone who tells you to think of your layoff as an opportunity
LB: Thirty-five people will say, “This is the best thing that will ever happen to you.” You’ll want to choke them all. In the long run, they are right.
I think the best thing you can do as a friend to people in this situation is to do two things. It’s just that I haven’t evolved much. Your friends might say, “That’s the worst.” What a terrible thing. ”They can smear your employer all day long in ways you can’t. Friends can be their worst selves to you.
And it will help by keeping your social rhythm the same as before. Much of our employment comes from our social rhythms and interactions with other people. When you go out into the world, those opportunities arise.
The biggest lesson in writing a book about layoffs
KO: How necessary is this conversation? Reporting on this book would have been very easy in terms of talking to the women in the book. It took me about a minute to find women willing to come out and talk about what had happened to them. Our hopes and dreams for this book are that you can understand the basic idea of what it means to be fired and how to get through it and come out stronger and face what comes next.
LB: Have women say, “I just read it.” This helped me. It makes me feel like I’m not alone. ”It was really wild. If we can change the way women think about being fired, and make them feel less embarrassed and more like, “Oh, I’m a cool woman,” that’s a win.
This interview has been edited for length and clarity.
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